 |
 |
 |
 |
 |
 |
 |
Forums - Mixing & FX
Subject: normalization help
Original Message Date: 04-Dec-02 @ 10:12 PM - normalization help
o.k. so i got this new track up and it seems really quiet. but i boosted the levels as hot as i could w/o clipping when i transferred it from minidisk to the harddisk. then i raised the amplitude to just below clipping in my wave manipulation program(nero waveburner. but now when i play back in winamp the frequency levels look super hot but the volume seems 2-3dB's lower than what i want. how can i get this without overloading something somewhere along the way?
Message 11/25 06-Dec-02 @ 04:20 PM - RE: normalization help
>10:1 is normally considered limiting. but still, 4:1 is rather much on a complete mix. as i´ve stated before, you should either do a very gentle compression on the whole mix (like 1.2-3:1 with a very low threshold) and take 2-3db off, or do serious limiting (10-infinity:1) with a very high threshold, and still only remove few db. mind you, that alesis isnt going to do either pretty good. thats why i was reccomending s/w from the start.
Message 12/25 06-Dec-02 @ 05:45 PM - RE: normalization help
i've heard both 4:1 and 10:1 being 'the beginning of limiting'.... just chose the more conservative number... it's just a guideline anyway, there's a lot more involved in 'true limiting'...
Message 13/25 06-Dec-02 @ 06:50 PM - RE: normalization help
It's all relative. Hell, the ratio knob on the SSL channel compressors goes from 1:1 to infinity:1 with NO MARKS in between, even at halfpoint! You just use your ears and the meters.
But higher ratios aren't always for limiting, either. I commonly use 8:1 on the 1176 for a kick drum. With a slow attack and about 6 dB of gain reduction, it really does wonderful things to a kick's waveform. Instead of phoooo, phoooo, phoooo, phoooo, you get POO, POO, POO, POO!
Hehe, I said poo poo.
psy
But higher ratios aren't always for limiting, either. I commonly use 8:1 on the 1176 for a kick drum. With a slow attack and about 6 dB of gain reduction, it really does wonderful things to a kick's waveform. Instead of phoooo, phoooo, phoooo, phoooo, you get POO, POO, POO, POO!
Hehe, I said poo poo.
psy
Message 14/25 06-Dec-02 @ 07:57 PM - RE: normalization help
lol "you get poo"! you got two people rolling on the floor here with laughter!
now, where was i... yeah, 1176 doesnt sound as brutal anyay, and with slow attack... ah nevermind, just wanted to say it was funny
now, where was i... yeah, 1176 doesnt sound as brutal anyay, and with slow attack... ah nevermind, just wanted to say it was funny
Message 15/25 07-Dec-02 @ 02:58 AM - RE: normalization help
1176? oh my, very nice. I've got an 1178, that I'm about to get working.
a.d.d.
Don't believe too much but your ears. First. MDs do NOT have good dynamics. That ATRAC compression throws away parts of the sound that you supposedly don't hear, but let me tell you; those thrown away parts make a BIG difference. Go straight to your HD. I'm a hardware fiend myself when it comes to the instrumentation, and original recording, when I can be, but I don't have the budget or the studio at the moment to be 100% and get the sound quality I can get by using both. For live, it's ALL hardware, but recorded...well you gotta go with what works and you can afford to get the highest quality sound that pleases your ears. Personally, I'd skip that 3630 altogether, record uncompressed and do your compression/limiting/normalization/volume maximization in the computer. I'm partial to Ozone myself, but that things kinda complex. You might want to start off with something a little easier to use like Wavehammer, and then see from there. The thing is that in a comp ALWAYS save a completely untouched, uncompressed, un eq'ed, unfucked with raw recording. Make copies and mess with those, but NEVER EVER EV ER mess with your raw master, cuz that's what may end up in a big bucks studio and be redone correctly, and if you're already messed it up doing a bed edit and saing it, then you're gonna be trying to pollish a turd. $.02
Ape
a.d.d.
Don't believe too much but your ears. First. MDs do NOT have good dynamics. That ATRAC compression throws away parts of the sound that you supposedly don't hear, but let me tell you; those thrown away parts make a BIG difference. Go straight to your HD. I'm a hardware fiend myself when it comes to the instrumentation, and original recording, when I can be, but I don't have the budget or the studio at the moment to be 100% and get the sound quality I can get by using both. For live, it's ALL hardware, but recorded...well you gotta go with what works and you can afford to get the highest quality sound that pleases your ears. Personally, I'd skip that 3630 altogether, record uncompressed and do your compression/limiting/normalization/volume maximization in the computer. I'm partial to Ozone myself, but that things kinda complex. You might want to start off with something a little easier to use like Wavehammer, and then see from there. The thing is that in a comp ALWAYS save a completely untouched, uncompressed, un eq'ed, unfucked with raw recording. Make copies and mess with those, but NEVER EVER EV ER mess with your raw master, cuz that's what may end up in a big bucks studio and be redone correctly, and if you're already messed it up doing a bed edit and saing it, then you're gonna be trying to pollish a turd. $.02
Ape
Message 16/25 08-Dec-02 @ 12:41 AM - RE: normalization help
A.D.D.
Posts: 137
Link?: No link
File?: No file
well, i never used the 3630 to compress the mix, i used the compression/normalization utility in waveburner. as for the 3630 being shit, i'm sure it is but its so much better than the dbx 166 i was using before it. i just don't have the cash to lay down on a $500 rnc. if i had that kind of cash i'd be picking up another synth or a tape delay or something useful. the only compressor i've ever really liked was my friends mxr dynacomp guitar pedal, "the source of the nashville sound", or so the box says. 2 knobs and an on/off switch. everything that went thru it sounded fantastic. little noisy though. oh and pongoid, i hate computers! i use one at work. i use one to do most of my school work. hell, i'm using one now to tool around the internet. when its time to make music the last thing i want to see is a computer. also, my comp. is NOT spec'd for music at all. soundblaster live value with mono 1/8in. jack i/o's!??! wtf am i supposed to do with those? new soundcard? for that money i could pick up one of the 2 adats with under 200 hours i just watched close on ebay for $300. got no money though so its all moot. just sold my pulse for $250 so maybe when i get that check. dunno. sorry if i seem like i'm not listening to what all of you are saying, its just that i've spent a couple of years just learning how to make music. then i spent a couple of years buying and selling gear and trying out everthing i could get my hands on until now i finally feel like i have a versatile core of soundmaking tools around me and i'm entering the final phase of my learning. namely, how to take everything i know about songwriting, synthesis and recording, apply it and using every available studio trick to make it sound f*cking trancendant. it's this studio trickery part that's throwing me. i know the minidisc is shite, but its not mine its just the best recorder i have access to until i get my own adat. where am i going with all this? maybe i just need a producer... ape you down?
Message 17/25 08-Dec-02 @ 12:43 AM - RE: normalization help
a.d.d.
Posts: 137
Link?: No link
File?: No file
almost forgot. ape, of course i saved an unadulterated copy, that was kinda why i was asking what to do... thanks
Message 18/25 08-Dec-02 @ 02:55 AM - RE: normalization help
You can get an RNC for under $200 if you talk the the right people. I picked up mine for $150, new in the box with the warantee, from a shop. They are not that expensive.
Am I down to be a producer? I've done it before and am doing it for some others now, from time to time. My time is precious so you better have some kind of financial arrangement in mind. I don't mind helping you with tips, but if you want the ears, the tools and the time, be ready to to pay me.
pongoid@hotmail.com
Let's talk.
Ape
Am I down to be a producer? I've done it before and am doing it for some others now, from time to time. My time is precious so you better have some kind of financial arrangement in mind. I don't mind helping you with tips, but if you want the ears, the tools and the time, be ready to to pay me.
pongoid@hotmail.com
Let's talk.
Ape
Message 19/25 08-Dec-02 @ 09:35 AM - RE: normalization help
"You can get an RNC for under $200 if you talk the the right people."
or you could just call FMR Audio who makes them and buy one for $200 even
or you could just call FMR Audio who makes them and buy one for $200 even
Message 20/25 09-Dec-02 @ 02:32 AM - RE: normalization help
every mastering engineer out there warns of the ill effects normalization has on the quality of the audio. you are mathematically changing the gain based on the highest peak and then multiplying that factor to each sliver of audio. math truncation is performed and the signal is degraded a generation. they use multiple pieces of hardware in a chain and then resample through high end converters like mytek or apogee. so if you can get it louder via hardware in the beginning, you will be better off. you may not be at the same peak level of zero, but the presence will be much better. I am ordering a fatso to accomplish this. it has a tracking comp followed by a no overshoot limiter for recording to digital. it isn’t cheap but it is supposed to do wonders for digital recordings. I think it will be worth if it does what it supposed to. You should be able to get good results with any decent compressor. The RNC look damn fine for the money. I thought you guys using it said it was best on the bus, but for tracking it was a little to bright and transparent for material with sharp transients.
Pages: 1 2 3
There are 25 total messages for this topic
Reply to Thread
You need to register/login to use the forum.
Click here to Signup or Login !
[you'll be brought right back to this point after signing up]
Back to Forum
