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Original Message Date: 17-Oct-02 @ 04:59 AM - guns

psylichon

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Just saw a trailer for Michael Moore's new movie "Bowling for Columbine." It's all about guns in America and it got me thinking. Why are guns such a problem in America? How 'sacred' is the second amendment?

Personally, I don't think guns serve any purpose but to kill. You can target shoot without lethal potential and you can kill animals without firepower. I don't like the government telling us what we can and cannot own, but I really don't see the need for guns in any society.

I'm curious what you guys think. Do we need guns? Would it make a noticeable social impact to outlaw guns? I think it may... more than waiting for the average American psyche to evolve.

Quoting Linda Richomond, "Twalk amongst yahselves"

I love the smell of stirred shit.

psylichon

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Message 121/147 22-Oct-02 @ 01:48 PM - RE: guns

Zazza

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i think it's cos you have trek thru cold damp bogland for hours to find someone to shoot..

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Message 122/147 22-Oct-02 @ 01:52 PM - RE: guns

cheddar

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wonder how much US (sponsored) munitions are with those countries "that beat out the US in the murder per capita stakes"

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Message 123/147 22-Oct-02 @ 02:41 PM - RE: guns

99devils

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I think there's very much a cultural aspect you guys are missing out on. In the States, a lot of murders come out of the "gangsta" culture. Take Buffalo, my city. There's a lot of murders in Buffalo, for our population size. Hell, there's just plain a lot of murders here. But those murders are generally confined to about 3 neighborhoods (in a city and suburban area of about 1 million people). Rarely do you hear about shootings in any other areas.

This is a conditioned response. We're talking about people who've grown up around the wrong examples, where they've seen this kind of thing their whole lives, and simply don't know any better.

Secondly, the point about gun laws only restricting law-abiding citizens from owning guns shouldn't be dismissed so easily. Most murders here are committed with illegal or unregistered guns.

I don't own a gun. My family wouldn't have them in the house when I was growing up, and I live in a very safe area of Buffalo (no murders here in Amherst - it's the safest town in the USA statistically). But if I was going to be living in Harlem, or Watts, you can bet your ass I'd be packing!

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Message 124/147 22-Oct-02 @ 04:37 PM - RE: guns

Zazza

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'Most murders here are committed with illegal or unregistered guns. '

which are mostly stolen from law-abiding citizens.

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Message 125/147 22-Oct-02 @ 06:33 PM - RE: guns

Luciferenda

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hey mac daddy...kick me yo email addy...

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Message 126/147 22-Oct-02 @ 06:43 PM - RE: guns

marianimal

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Why do my priorities have to be either/or? You're making things black and white when they're not. Yes, I prefer to survive until I feel I've accomplished my purposes here on earth, one of which I do think is setting an example. I'm considered a pretty generous and honest person, which is at least the start of an example I'd like to set. I'm also responsible, and that means that if I did own a gun, which I don't at this time, I would own it responsibly and you wouldn't see me out acting like an idiot with it. If I needed to defend myself with my bare hands or whatever, I would do that too. At the same time, I'm aware that I won't live forever, and at some moment may decide NOT to defend myself, or I may realize I'm beat if it comes to that. Just cos I might want to have a gun doesn't mean I'm going to use it on every possible occasion. Now your equation seems to be, if you have a gun you can't be for higher consciousness, and that's just bullshit.

Let me digress a moment and try to make this clearer for Psylichon. You're interested in compassion, I imagine. Maybe it's really non-violence you're about, but I'm going to talk about compassion because I think that's prolly the highest value there is. If someone brutally attacks me, I personally don't think it's necessarily compassionate to just let that happen and let that person continue being a brutal attacker. The type of compassion I'm aware of is being honest with people, and if they're doing something fucked up I am not going to smooth things over for them and make it easier to continue to be that way. This is my decision, in the moment, based on whatever happens. It doesn't necessarily mean I'll try to kill the person but fer damn sure I'm going to obstruct the progress of their fucked-up behavior. And yes, I do believe that is compassion and caring for others. I'm also caring for the next person that the aggresive person might consider attacking.

The point is, if more people in general would use their goddam sensibilities, we wouldn't be so violent and cruel, we would find better ways to vent or transform our aggression, and whether or not anyone has weapons wouldn't really be an issue. And I'll point out just one more time: making guns illegal would NOT make them DISAPPEAR, so all those arguments that go "this gun-related incident would never have happened if guns were illegal" really don't make sense. The guns in many of those situations are illegal anyway.

Hehe, have fun in SoCal, Luciferanda & Influx. :-)

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Message 127/147 22-Oct-02 @ 06:54 PM - RE: guns

Luciferenda

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mari..nicely done. very much agree.

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Message 128/147 22-Oct-02 @ 07:54 PM - RE: guns

influx

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oh QUIT!
nflux1@aol.com

you do know that Uberzone is playing tomorrow at boombox?

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Message 129/147 22-Oct-02 @ 08:03 PM - RE: guns

marianimal

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Well it does sound like some cool stuff going on there. Have to come down sometime.

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Message 130/147 22-Oct-02 @ 08:38 PM - RE: guns

Luciferenda

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Got it. Ya, I know, but I got midterms this week and I'm SWAMPED with that right now. So I can't make it tomorrow.

Mari..please do. :o)

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