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Forums - The lounge
Subject: Faith
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Original Message Date: 24-Sep-02 @ 05:37 AM - Faith
I'm really curious about the kinds of things we put our faith into. There's a lot of talk about various religions and the differences between them lately, but a lot of the talk sounds like a book report. What I mean is, it sounds like well-collected information culled from various readings (most of them from reputable sources, no doubt) used to form an opinion about a subject. The problem is that we can't read everything. And even if we could, reading without bias does not occur. You have an opinion before you start that affects everything that passes through you, and you only take what you feel is important. It just seems like a snowball effect that leaves you old, bitter towards the world, and highly opinionated (often complaining about how others are stubborn in their reasoning... etc....)
I think live, interactive debate cannot be surpassed as a learning experience. To really take in someone else's view on life and the things that are important to them is one of the greatest gifts we have (it's reflected in our music, and subsequent appreciation of each other's creations). The same biases can take place as in reading, but I think the dynamic nature of a conversation eliminates unchecked bias without reason.
Ok, now to my point. I was raised Christian. My mother is very active in the church, and follows very conservative Christian values. I used to be very active in the church with youth groups, mission work, and stuff like that. After the self-exploration that is college, I strayed away (does this sound familiar to anyone?) My mother and I lately have been getting into spiritual conversations, and she is ever more vocal about her disappointment in the direction my beliefs are heading.
I want to know what it is about Christianity that makes it so prevalent in today's society? I mean, millions of people don't choose this lifestyle just because their parents did. I know that Christianity goes deep, I've just never felt it. And I don't want slagging answers from non-Christians... "it's a crutch, a lie, a shame, etc." I've heard all that and I don't learn a thing from it. I want a personal account of why someone puts their faith in Christian ideals.
And so help me if someone accuses someone else of trying to "force" their opinion on others, I'm gonna shit all over you because that stuff just kills the kind of debate that I'm looking for here. And I don't want philosophical ramblings that you've heard and can relate to and they sound cool, but they aren't you. I want only deep ideas that have really been thought out.
This kind of stuff is important to me, so please take this thread seriously. If the lounge is not the place for this kind of discussion, let me know and I'll take it elsewhere....?
Thanks for really thinking about it, guys. This could be really cool...
Dave
p.s. - Yes, Jamie, I know you're the resident Christian here, and I'm kinda hoping you'll help me start things here, if you want...
Message 131/188 29-Sep-02 @ 10:11 PM - RE: Faith
Zazza
Posts: 1502
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or do you see yourself as a conceptual subversive or summat?
Now, don't get me wrong, I'm just interested in your agenda...
Message 132/188 29-Sep-02 @ 11:28 PM - RE: Faith
psylichon
Message 133/188 30-Sep-02 @ 01:05 AM - RE: Faith
i can't change the past, and i can't change what crappy people have done, but i can act now to change points henceforth. yes, you can open minds. yes, you can educate. and if you tell me otherwise, i'm going to punch you.
then when you're holding your hand over your nose i'm going to call you a robot, and you'll be all like "no, xoxos, no" but deep inside you'll know and you'll have to say "yes, yes.."
with awesome distain and terrible love,
xoxos.
Message 134/188 30-Sep-02 @ 11:37 AM - RE: Faith
Zazza
Posts: 1502
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I also look after a variety of people in the third world through various mechanisms and also put my money where my mouth is by sponsoring various 'conscious' websites...
So, more power to you my friend, you'll get nothing but support from me!
Message 135/188 30-Sep-02 @ 12:02 PM - RE: Faith
same for p - benefit of laughter noted, but it's a sour fix when those akitas come rolling around. "but, ho ho, they did fuck and snap my neck with such panache.." not
driven to repeat these points.. they're so timely!
aah, one of my neighbors just got marauded. police way too late.
Message 136/188 30-Sep-02 @ 05:35 PM - RE: Faith
All I meant was that, like most internet threads this one had descended into an odd mish mash of quasi-wisdom and rant. Wouldn't follow these forums if they bugged me.
Sorry to give the impression of frustration...
It's the reading list's I often find the most interesting in the end.
e
Message 137/188 01-Oct-02 @ 11:16 AM - RE: Faith
Zazza
Posts: 1502
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He who writes betrays the truth.
Message 138/188 11-Oct-02 @ 06:26 AM - RE: Faith
"Hindu mythology is virtually a large-scale
projection into the psychological realm of
microscopic scientific discoveries. Hindu deities
such as Shiva and Vishnu continually dance the
creation and destruction of universes while the Buddhist image of the wheel of life symbolizes the unending process of birth, death, and rebirth which is a part of the world of form, which is emptiness, which is form.
Subatomic particles forever partake of this unceasing dance of annihilation and creation. In fact, subatomic particles *are* this unceasing dance of annihilation and creation. This twentieth-century discovery, with all its
psychedelic implications, is not a new concept.
In fact, it is very similar to the way that much of the earth's population, including the Hindus
and the Buddhists, view their reality.
Imagine that a group of young artists have
founded a new and revolutionary school of art.
Their paintings are so unique that they have come
to share them with the curator of an old museum.
The curator regards the new paintings, nods his
head, and disappears into the vaults of the
museum. He returns carrying some very old
paintings, which he places beside the new ones.
The new art is so similar to the old art that
even the young artists are taken aback. The new
revolutionaries, in their own time and in their
own way, have rediscovered a very old school of
painting."
-Gary Zukav, "The Dancing Wu Li Masters"
psylichon
Message 139/188 11-Oct-02 @ 08:16 AM - RE: Faith
"Randolph Bourne's observation "war is the health of the state" is familiar to most critics of militarism, but few have delved into why this is so. Statism is dependent upon mass thinking which, in turn, is essential to the creation of a collective, herd-oriented society. Such pack-like behavior is reflected in the intellectual and spiritual passivity of people whose mindsets are wrapped up more in images and appearances than in concrete reality.
Such a collapse of the mind produces a society dominated by entertainmen, which places little burden on thinking,ather than critical inquiry, which helps to explain why there has long been a symbiotic relationship between the entertainment industry and political systems. Entertainment fosters a passive consciousness, a willingness to "suspend our disbelief." Its purpose is to generate amusement, a word that is synonymous with "diversion," meaning "to distract the attention of." The common reference to movies as a form of "escape" from reality, reflects this function. Government officials know what every magician knows, namely, that to carry out their illusions, they must divert the audience's attention from their hidden purposes. "
_Politics and War As Entertainment_ by Butler Shaffer
psylichon
Message 140/188 11-Oct-02 @ 11:17 AM - RE: Faith
___________________________________
I had an idea for a script once. It's basically Jaws except when the guys in the boat are going after Jaws, they look around and there's an even bigger Jaws. The guys have to team up with Jaws to get Bigger Jaws.... I call it... Big Jaws!!!
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