 |
 |
 |
 |
 |
 |
 |
Forums - The lounge
Subject: Faith
Pages: 1 ... 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 ... 19
Original Message Date: 24-Sep-02 @ 05:37 AM - Faith
I'm really curious about the kinds of things we put our faith into. There's a lot of talk about various religions and the differences between them lately, but a lot of the talk sounds like a book report. What I mean is, it sounds like well-collected information culled from various readings (most of them from reputable sources, no doubt) used to form an opinion about a subject. The problem is that we can't read everything. And even if we could, reading without bias does not occur. You have an opinion before you start that affects everything that passes through you, and you only take what you feel is important. It just seems like a snowball effect that leaves you old, bitter towards the world, and highly opinionated (often complaining about how others are stubborn in their reasoning... etc....)
I think live, interactive debate cannot be surpassed as a learning experience. To really take in someone else's view on life and the things that are important to them is one of the greatest gifts we have (it's reflected in our music, and subsequent appreciation of each other's creations). The same biases can take place as in reading, but I think the dynamic nature of a conversation eliminates unchecked bias without reason.
Ok, now to my point. I was raised Christian. My mother is very active in the church, and follows very conservative Christian values. I used to be very active in the church with youth groups, mission work, and stuff like that. After the self-exploration that is college, I strayed away (does this sound familiar to anyone?) My mother and I lately have been getting into spiritual conversations, and she is ever more vocal about her disappointment in the direction my beliefs are heading.
I want to know what it is about Christianity that makes it so prevalent in today's society? I mean, millions of people don't choose this lifestyle just because their parents did. I know that Christianity goes deep, I've just never felt it. And I don't want slagging answers from non-Christians... "it's a crutch, a lie, a shame, etc." I've heard all that and I don't learn a thing from it. I want a personal account of why someone puts their faith in Christian ideals.
And so help me if someone accuses someone else of trying to "force" their opinion on others, I'm gonna shit all over you because that stuff just kills the kind of debate that I'm looking for here. And I don't want philosophical ramblings that you've heard and can relate to and they sound cool, but they aren't you. I want only deep ideas that have really been thought out.
This kind of stuff is important to me, so please take this thread seriously. If the lounge is not the place for this kind of discussion, let me know and I'll take it elsewhere....?
Thanks for really thinking about it, guys. This could be really cool...
Dave
p.s. - Yes, Jamie, I know you're the resident Christian here, and I'm kinda hoping you'll help me start things here, if you want...
Message 63/188 26-Sep-02 @ 12:28 PM - RE: Faith
___________________________________
I had an idea for a script once. It's basically Jaws except when the guys in the boat are going after Jaws, they look around and there's an even bigger Jaws. The guys have to team up with Jaws to get Bigger Jaws.... I call it... Big Jaws!!!
Message 64/188 26-Sep-02 @ 03:26 PM - RE: Faith
1) we get to decide what he is like and make up and ascribe any characterists about him that we want to.
2) we trust humans who have had interactions with him directly in the past to tell us what he is like as he described himself.
to me number 1 is stupid. anyone can make up anything they want about god and that doesn't make it true. heck we can't even agree on items we have tons of evidence on in the physical realm. so now anyone's whim about what god may be like is valid?
to me number 2 is the better way. but it requires that you put trust in written historical accounts. of course there is reason to believe or disbelieve various accounts etc. you have to sort thru all that stuff and some people will never trust *anything* any person has written and resort to number 1.
in either way of 'knowing about god' you have the personal experience. some people limit their experience to the natural realm, others take it to the supernatural. you can do 1 or 2 from a natural or supernatural experiential viewpoint.
so i take it me and nomad are of persuasion 2 and everyone else here is liking 1.
thoughts on that?
jamey
Message 65/188 26-Sep-02 @ 03:53 PM Edit: 26-Sep-02 | 03:58 PM - RE: Faith
Steve Roughley
Posts: 1178
Link?: No link
File?: No file
Regards.
Steve.
Message 66/188 26-Sep-02 @ 04:10 PM - RE: Faith
i think thats what most people do out in the general population. well they probably do 2 and if they get disenfranchised they jump to 1 or none...
jamey
Message 67/188 26-Sep-02 @ 05:27 PM Edit: 26-Sep-02 | 05:29 PM - RE: Faith
Steve Roughley
Posts: 1178
Link?: No link
File?: No file
But, yes; I feel that option 2 is unreliable as what we are told about God, and so on, is too bizzarre for me and it is open to abuse.
Regards.
Steve.
Message 68/188 26-Sep-02 @ 06:51 PM - RE: Faith
Those words alone are enough to invalidate method 2, as far as I'm concerned. And I'd like to add a third moethod of knowing God, an edited version of #1:
3) we get to DISCOVER what he is like and DISCERN any characterists about him that we CAN.
Scientists rarely talk about God in the lab, but many of them are devoutly spiritual after the discoveries of the past few decades. When I talk about God as the simplest form, it's not to fulfill my desire for his form, it's to agree with the mathematical model of pure symmetry, total unification. Non-local spacetime events were once the subject of science fiction and miracles. Now they do that sort of thing all the time.
I don't place all my faith in science (it WILL NOT give us the "final answer"), but I think it can draw a great map for spirituality. If science can, in any way, break through the illusion of the senses and give us an idea greater than ourselves, then things can really start to change.
It's like a road map. You could have a map of a city that is detailed and correct in every conceivable manner, but until you actually go down the roads, you won't really KNOW the city.
And I wouldn't put all my faith in people's accounts of their road trip, either.
psylichon
Message 70/188 26-Sep-02 @ 08:43 PM - RE: Faith
#3 - if you shut up the mind all will be music what sculpture of sound cannot what cannot et c.
still brewing a notion to do 'storm the studio #1' ie. it's genocide oh can't you see et c. in that one 'fly my beautiful balloon' style.. got a catchy banjo riff.
anyway. if no one ever told you anythnig about god it'd be a lot better for seeing eh?
unlearn, you must :p
die religion die
Pages: 1 ... 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 ... 19
There are 188 total messages for this topic
Reply to Thread
You need to register/login to use the forum.
Click here to Signup or Login !
[you'll be brought right back to this point after signing up]
Back to Forum
