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Subject: Desperate for Bass Width!!!!

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Original Message 1/6 28-Aug-99 @ 05:52 AM - Desperate for Bass Width!!!!

StevePote

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Spending the last couple of days with someone pushing the Novation to it's limits, having done the same to the Korg, I have to say I could understand his frustration. Neither really seemed capable of producing a source sound with the presence to warrant further work on it. I don't speak from experience myself, so I have a need to know: How are people like Andy C and the like getting the terrifying volume and size of sound when their bass hits. And not only that, how are they producing that amount of interesting movement in one sound. If you know what I'm talking about, you will understand what I mean. I'm starting to wonder if that sort of sound is unachievable without investing thousands. As an aside, has anyone got any thoughts on production of huge bass using the E-Mu Samplers or Synth Samplers? Reply, even if it is only to give me abuse, but please say something constructive. And make it as technical as you have to. I really want to understand this.

Regards.

Steve.

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Message 2/6 28-Aug-99 @ 09:28 AM - RE: Desperate for Bass Width!!!!

sam

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Actually, the SN has a very powerful bass, but you've got to get it right. The Andy C sound (and the like) your talking about are often very compressed. If you've got about 500 quid (7-800 dollars) flying round, go out and get yourself a Focusrite Compounder. The 'huge bass' controls are not just gimmicks, they really thicken the sound out at 'floor shake' frequency and don't sound too boomy. You can get pretty close with out though, use layers to create much thicker sounds (ie performance mode) start with a good sound, add some sub bass, etc. To get the sound motion your talking about, you need to use lots of controllers, controlling things like freq cutoff, resonance, sync, etc. Record what you intend to play first, then use both hands and give those knobs a twist.

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Message 3/6 29-Aug-99 @ 04:13 PM - RE: Desperate for Bass Width!!!!

StevePote

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many thanks for sending me a message, my names daniel Im the guy who is actually using the sn. Firstly the sn cant produce proper sub bass due to the fact it hasnt got a sine wave . You can soften the square wave but as its not a sine wave and contains various partial frquencys it sounds naff. When listening to people like bad company or andy c etc the bass changes like a synth but does not sound like one.EG you cant hear an oscillator but more of a wall of sound ??
Layering on the supernova didnt really help, youre correct when saying it can thicken up sounds but only what youve already got. There aren't any real tone controls on the sn and editing is a joke. You have very little control over anything. Envelopes are great but only for shaping a sound over time, not changing its timbre.
If you have any examples of sounds that i could hear please send them to me, id really appreciate it. Also are there any synths that are better atr producing proper bass.
many thanks daniel dotor

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Message 4/6 02-Sep-99 @ 01:35 PM - RE: Desperate for Bass Width!!!!

sam

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erm... a softened square wave is pretty much a sine wave (I can't hear the difference, you may be able to see some difference on a scope though), but that's not really the point. I think you might be a bit confused here - you don't have to have a sine wave to create sub bass. Sub bass is simply a low freq. around 40 hz. Go much lower than 20-30 and you'll start messing up your mix. To get a really thick bass sound that makes the floor shake, you need not just one sub freq. (try just one low sine wave and you'll hear how pants it sounds), but a set of low harmonics. Easiest way to start - square wave, soften it a bit. Add a second osc, slightly detuned. Now put the filter cutoff just over the low freq area and give it bit of resonance. This should create a simple strong deep bass sound. Square waves are quite good low down as they don't tend to cloud the low end to much because they don't have too many close harmonics.
I don't know how much that'll help you, but it's a good a starting place as any. Over under 'Drum'n'ass' we're stuck on pretty much this very subject. But the point is, it is possible. I will get round to posting what I have done as soon as possible ( to the sn mailing list that is ).

- Sam

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Message 5/6 02-Sep-99 @ 02:34 PM - RE: Desperate for Bass Width!!!!

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OS3 will give a true sine with the soften parameter set to 100%, however, it is very close in OS2 and with the FC low I doubt you'll notice the difference as the higher harmonics are cut out anyway.

The sounds you want to acheive are a product of skilled use of outboard EQ etc. The SN has a better bottom end than any of the other VA synths I've tried (JP8K, Korg Prophecy, Nord Modular etc.) A lot of the mixes you hear are put through multi-band compression to get a very tight sound.

Good luck.

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Message 6/6 02-Sep-99 @ 10:23 PM - RE: Desperate for Bass Width!!!!

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also i cant see what you mean about the envelopes not being able to change timbre over time?... there are 2 spares surely?

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