threshold v. gain redutcion - Mixing & FX forums

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Subject: threshold v. gain redutcion

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Original Message 1/16 09-Aug-02 @ 09:51 PM - threshold v. gain redutcion

bedwyr

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ok, it's another compression question.

i keep reading about compression settings (this month it's mainly low ratio (1.2) with 30-40db threshold for a whole mix) and was wondering why they always quote threshold and not gain reduction. i guess the gain reduction depends on your material.

the resulting sound is going to depend on your input level surely. so when they mention 30-40db threshold is that assuming your peaks are coming in at 0db? or what?

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Message 2/16 09-Aug-02 @ 10:01 PM - RE: threshold v. gain redutcion

damballah

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The whole threshold and ratio thing are intertwined. at -30 db threshold with low ratio, you'd be compressing everything just a little. with the threshold up closer to 0 with a higher ratio, you'd just compress the peaks. both methods might hit the same number on the gain reduction meter but give you a different sound, depending on the material and all.

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Message 3/16 09-Aug-02 @ 10:05 PM - RE: threshold v. gain redutcion

beds

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aye, but what about your input level? if it's less than 0db or more, then you'll get a different sound. should i assume it to be peaks at 0db?

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Message 4/16 09-Aug-02 @ 10:06 PM - RE: threshold v. gain redutcion

Brett

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exactly! the threshold is irrelivant if you don't know how much gain reduction, and make up is being achieved. It's like saying, I mix my kick drum with the fader at -5. It realy doesn't matter if we don't know what the peak level is. it could be -10, or it could be -20. The threshold is just a knob setting and not the result of level change in the meterial.

where did they have the attack and release? slow ?

and what type of comp, elop, fet, or the mastering vari-mu's. The type has a lot to do whith where you can go and how deep wihtout pumping and artifacts. The waves c4 is pretty damn nice on stereo material. I just got it. It's like four RCL's without minus the limiter.

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Message 5/16 09-Aug-02 @ 10:16 PM - RE: threshold v. gain redutcion

beds

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Well, i don't know about it being irrelevant, but as it's what seems to be quoted all the time, i was wandering.

Obviously 'use your ears' will rear it's head here *chuckle* *groan*

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Message 6/16 09-Aug-02 @ 10:19 PM - RE: threshold v. gain redutcion

influx

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you were wandering?

aye geezah! JUST USE YOUR EARS!

just kiddin.

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Message 7/16 09-Aug-02 @ 10:23 PM - RE: threshold v. gain redutcion

damballah

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ok, analog board -- if you set up your gain on your kick channel so it's hitting at 0db and patch a compressor into the insert, it doesn't matter where your fader is. the fader feeds the mix buss. the insert is before that. at 0 db threshold and 0db makeup on the comp, you should be close to unity. now you dork around with the threshold and ratio. your light/needle is showing X amount of gain reduction. you turn the makeup gain up to X and you're close to unity again but with compression. it really don't matter what type of comp you use as far as the above is concerned. yeah they have different sonic characteristics, but the signal chain's pretty much the same.

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Message 8/16 09-Aug-02 @ 10:24 PM - RE: threshold v. gain redutcion

beds

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hehe, yes, i was wandering around the magazine shelves in w.h. smiths.

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Message 9/16 09-Aug-02 @ 10:49 PM - RE: threshold v. gain redutcion

influx

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careful. people get arrested for that!

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Message 10/16 09-Aug-02 @ 11:06 PM - RE: threshold v. gain redutcion

beds

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fack in hell, you're country is more fkd than i thought! you get arrested for not buying magazines?

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Message 11/16 10-Aug-02 @ 10:39 AM - RE: threshold v. gain redutcion

beds

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and yeah, thanks d, it makes sense if you think of it in those terms. damn software mixers.

so shall i get into the habit of getting my signal to hit 0db on the meter (with the fader at 0 and no inserts)? then when i patch a compressor in i can just dial in a 30db threshold etc. and then use me fader for the volume.

seeing as there is no little blinking led and a gain pot.

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Message 12/16 10-Aug-02 @ 12:43 PM - RE: threshold v. gain redutcion

milan

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duh. i turn my head away for a second and immidiately you bring up an interesting question.

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Message 13/16 10-Aug-02 @ 02:22 PM - RE: threshold v. gain redutcion

xoxos

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is it just me, or does the use of a compressor on the master outs in logic have some kind of stupid level detection where you lose a few db of headroom regardless of settings?

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Message 14/16 11-Aug-02 @ 05:14 AM - RE: threshold v. gain redutcion

damballah

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dunno x, don't use logic.

well, beds, there's some different schools of thought. A. Make sure all digitally recorded signals are peaking near digital zero for best audio quality. B. Record everything at close to their relative mix levels. The theory here is if you've got a ticky little hi-hat track, frinstance, that's going to be relatively soft, you don't have to turn it way up and then turn it way down. That means you're mixing in the good part of the fader and not fidgeting around the very bottom of it's range. but if you're compressing sumpin to get more of that in-your-face sound, it probably isn't one of those subtle background things anyway, so treat your tracking levels as the gain staging of your s/w mixer.

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Message 15/16 11-Aug-02 @ 09:25 AM - RE: threshold v. gain redutcion

influx

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hmmm.....

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Message 16/16 11-Aug-02 @ 12:33 PM - RE: threshold v. gain redutcion

xoxos

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well you ought to so you can know.

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