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Forums - Music techology
Subject: thiefs...
Viewing all 13 messages - View by pages of 10: 1 2
Original Message 1/13 06-Feb-08 @ 10:54 AM - thiefs...
Recently I have been involved in a guitar based blues-ish rock project (mostly doing the mixing and final touching up) and when I wanted to upload it here (we're looking for a singer, and also probably we could prolly use some of the feedback from you guys), my partner (who does the guitar and drum stuff) protested, coz' he was so afraid that someone might just pop in, listens to this song and steals all the ideas and makes big money out of it...
Now I know this kind of stuff has happened before, but to be frank I really don't see this as a big risk to take... I have never been concerned about this before, maybe I should, but well, I don't think my ideas are really worth stealing and "re-implementing" and selling...
Anyway, I have to respect my partners decision on this, but I just wanted to know if any of you have anything to add to this... of yourse, most of the members here have stuff added to the music site, so that partly answers the question... but any of you register any of your works at some kind of copyright organisation?
Now I know this kind of stuff has happened before, but to be frank I really don't see this as a big risk to take... I have never been concerned about this before, maybe I should, but well, I don't think my ideas are really worth stealing and "re-implementing" and selling...
Anyway, I have to respect my partners decision on this, but I just wanted to know if any of you have anything to add to this... of yourse, most of the members here have stuff added to the music site, so that partly answers the question... but any of you register any of your works at some kind of copyright organisation?
Message 2/13 06-Feb-08 @ 02:47 PM - RE: thiefs...
well, it can happen... i guess you have to be careful but not paranoid
stuff that wasnt signed to a publisher I usualy either send it to myself by registered post, or put it in a bank vault,
i dont think the 'send to yourself by registered post' works legaly outside the uk, or at least not sure it works in USA courts
stuff that wasnt signed to a publisher I usualy either send it to myself by registered post, or put it in a bank vault,
i dont think the 'send to yourself by registered post' works legaly outside the uk, or at least not sure it works in USA courts
___________________________________
I had an idea for a script once. It's basically Jaws except when the guys in the boat are going after Jaws, they look around and there's an even bigger Jaws. The guys have to team up with Jaws to get Bigger Jaws.... I call it... Big Jaws!!!
Message 3/13 06-Feb-08 @ 03:59 PM - RE: thiefs...
I often think about this very situation, but I really don't believe that someone would blatantly just rip your song or it innards right from listening to it. Now, EVERYONE gains ideas by listening to others' music and it's usually subtle and nothing to worry about. Of course I'm going to refer to classical music again, but composers are constantly encouraged to follow music scores while listening to the music to understand how things are done. Just last night I followed Gustav Holst's "The Planets" with the scores at least three times through last night, it's how we learn... not the point though...
Now, this is out of respect for your band mate, so I wouldn't against his wishes, but I wouldn't worry about putting up music myself. I do send most of my work to the library of congress for copyright purposes (I live in the US) and I send multiple tracks on one CD so that I don't have to pay for each song. This is just to be safe.
Also, there are literally thousands among thousands of rock, blues, metal, {enter genre here} that people can rip ideas from. I mean just turn on the radio,everything still sounds like I-IV-V-I, but in the bands desired key. I'm not saying anything bad about your band of course, but if one were to look for ideas to steal (as slimy as that motherf**er would be to do such a thing) there's tens of millions of songs to choose from.
I guess bottom line is: respect wishes, but I wouldn't worry about it all that much, to be honest for your personal material. If it is an issue, get the material copyrighted and then you shouldn't have any problems.
DISCLAIMER: In no way is this legal advice given from Mr. C. Hook , it is just a story his personal life experiences. If and in which any legal standings, whether in and/ or out of court, the aforementioned Mr. Hook shall [in no way or form] take responsibility for anything that is read in this message that may be read and interpreted as such information for professional or personal legal advice, which may or may not cause loss and/ or additions to the reader's assets.
Capthook
Now, this is out of respect for your band mate, so I wouldn't against his wishes, but I wouldn't worry about putting up music myself. I do send most of my work to the library of congress for copyright purposes (I live in the US) and I send multiple tracks on one CD so that I don't have to pay for each song. This is just to be safe.
Also, there are literally thousands among thousands of rock, blues, metal, {enter genre here} that people can rip ideas from. I mean just turn on the radio,everything still sounds like I-IV-V-I, but in the bands desired key. I'm not saying anything bad about your band of course, but if one were to look for ideas to steal (as slimy as that motherf**er would be to do such a thing) there's tens of millions of songs to choose from.
I guess bottom line is: respect wishes, but I wouldn't worry about it all that much, to be honest for your personal material. If it is an issue, get the material copyrighted and then you shouldn't have any problems.
DISCLAIMER: In no way is this legal advice given from Mr. C. Hook , it is just a story his personal life experiences. If and in which any legal standings, whether in and/ or out of court, the aforementioned Mr. Hook shall [in no way or form] take responsibility for anything that is read in this message that may be read and interpreted as such information for professional or personal legal advice, which may or may not cause loss and/ or additions to the reader's assets.
Capthook
Message 4/13 06-Feb-08 @ 04:10 PM - RE: thiefs...
quote
DISCLAIMER: In no way is this legal advice given from Mr. C. Hook , it is just a story his personal life experiences. If and in which any legal standings, whether in and/ or out of court, the aforementioned Mr. Hook shall [in no way or form] take responsibility for anything that is read in this message that may be read and interpreted as such information for professional or personal legal advice, which may or may not cause loss and/ or additions to the readers assets.
Capthook
DISCLAIMER: In no way is this legal advice given from Mr. C. Hook , it is just a story his personal life experiences. If and in which any legal standings, whether in and/ or out of court, the aforementioned Mr. Hook shall [in no way or form] take responsibility for anything that is read in this message that may be read and interpreted as such information for professional or personal legal advice, which may or may not cause loss and/ or additions to the readers assets.
Capthook
agreed, i take ideas from songs all the time, but you dont totaly copy, you hear an idea and think, "Thats cool" and kinda copy it if you get me? You work on your own version of it so to speak.. thats unavoidable I guess
___________________________________
I had an idea for a script once. It's basically Jaws except when the guys in the boat are going after Jaws, they look around and there's an even bigger Jaws. The guys have to team up with Jaws to get Bigger Jaws.... I call it... Big Jaws!!!
Message 5/13 06-Feb-08 @ 04:11 PM - RE: thiefs...
Also, not to be the bringer of bad news, but if this very situation of ripping off ideas did happen and you did get the material copyrighted, you would still have to pay $$ for an attorney, take time from school/work to be in court, and then tack on another few thousand dollars for court fees. This is all, of course, if the persons(s) (aka dumb slimy motherf*cker(s)) taking your ideas agree to go to court after knowing that you have the essential paperwork to prove them wrong in a law suit.
DISCLAIMER: In no way is this legal advice given from Mr. C. Hook , it is just a story his personal life experiences. If and in which any legal standings, whether in and/ or out of court, the aforementioned Mr. Hook shall [in no way or form] take responsibility for anything that is read in this message that may be read and interpreted as such information for professional or personal legal advice, which may or may not cause loss and/ or additions to the reader's assets.
Capthook
DISCLAIMER: In no way is this legal advice given from Mr. C. Hook , it is just a story his personal life experiences. If and in which any legal standings, whether in and/ or out of court, the aforementioned Mr. Hook shall [in no way or form] take responsibility for anything that is read in this message that may be read and interpreted as such information for professional or personal legal advice, which may or may not cause loss and/ or additions to the reader's assets.
Capthook
Message 6/13 07-Feb-08 @ 05:48 AM Edit: 07-Feb-08 | 05:55 AM - RE: thiefs...
In a way, posting here is proof. There's a date stamp stamp and a record stored. Join a rights society (PRS etc) to avoid the potential costs mentioned above.
Oh, and I agree with K's point above. Inspiration is a humbling thing to give, but being emulated (or ripped off) is creepy and annoying.
Dis claim, er, is de opinion dat I av! It would light a fool the way to dusty death (pardons to Bill).
Oh, and I agree with K's point above. Inspiration is a humbling thing to give, but being emulated (or ripped off) is creepy and annoying.
Dis claim, er, is de opinion dat I av! It would light a fool the way to dusty death (pardons to Bill).
Message 7/13 07-Feb-08 @ 07:36 AM - RE: thiefs...
quote
Join a rights society
Join a rights society
Hmmm, well, maybe that's the easiest thing to do in my position... I have always thought that it is unnecesary, but from your replies I see that being ripped off is a somewhat valid threat, at least on a theoretical level
Of course it is a different question how a simple bloke like me (without a huge "back-office" organisation) can even realise that on the other side of the world someone is copying and selling my stuff. (a very remote possibility but... well). Not to mention going to court.
I'll do some research how this is done properly, thanks for the input!
quote
agreed, i take ideas from songs all the time, but you dont totaly copy, you hear an idea and think, "Thats cool" and kinda copy it if you get me? You work on your own version of it so to speak.. thats unavoidable I guess
agreed, i take ideas from songs all the time, but you dont totaly copy, you hear an idea and think, "Thats cool" and kinda copy it if you get me? You work on your own version of it so to speak.. thats unavoidable I guess
yeah, and even if someone takes samples... that should be OK IMO if he does something with it, (cuts it up, distorts to hell, I mean if it's not just a tempo change and copy-paste). By law of course it is considered illegal...
The worst thing is when you "invent" some melody, or chord progression or something, and then you later on realise that someone has done it before in a different context
quote
Now, this is out of respect for your band mate, so I wouldn't against his wishes, but I wouldn't worry about putting up music myself. I do send most of my work to the library of congress for copyright purposes (I live in the US) and I send multiple tracks on one CD so that I don't have to pay for each song. This is just to be safe.
Now, this is out of respect for your band mate, so I wouldn't against his wishes, but I wouldn't worry about putting up music myself. I do send most of my work to the library of congress for copyright purposes (I live in the US) and I send multiple tracks on one CD so that I don't have to pay for each song. This is just to be safe.
Well, I think I will check what are the regulations around here (Hungary). Copyright laws around the EU (and especially Eastern-europe) tend to be rather different, eg. I just realised one day that downloading a copyrighted piece of music from the internet is perfecly ok with the law, as long as I do it for my own personal use...
Message 8/13 07-Feb-08 @ 09:35 AM - RE: thiefs...
quote
The worst thing is when you invent some melody, or chord progression or something, and then you later on realise that someone has done it before in a different context
The worst thing is when you invent some melody, or chord progression or something, and then you later on realise that someone has done it before in a different context
I have done this many times and it pissed me off to no end! It's the worst because this wonderful idea begins to unfold in my head becoming bigger and more complex and BAM! my wife will come by the studio and say something like "Oh, are you playing so-and-so's songs?" or "That's the theme to this movie,isn't it beautiful?"
Emulation is okay because 99.9% of the time the emulator will take a whole different direction than the emulatee
It's like filtering an idea through a different mind all together. I'd like to test this out by setting out some standard rules/ guidelines to a track and have all who wish to participate to produce a two minute or so track to see how many tracks sound the same/ different, given the strict guidelines to follow.
Message 9/13 07-Feb-08 @ 09:45 AM - RE: thiefs...
I'm with the "post to self" method, as shown to me by Marc Darkstate:
When a song is finished burn the whole project including midi, audio, arrange, etc data on a CD and mail it to yourself. That way you will have a sealed envelope with a date on it, proving that you made the tune and WHEN you made it. Cheap copyright technique
When a song is finished burn the whole project including midi, audio, arrange, etc data on a CD and mail it to yourself. That way you will have a sealed envelope with a date on it, proving that you made the tune and WHEN you made it. Cheap copyright technique
Message 10/13 07-Feb-08 @ 05:40 PM - RE: thiefs...
Milan, yeah, but I wonder if that kind of stuff would be sufficient in the EU... gotta ask a lawyer about that. On the other hand I'd love to use some kind of alternate method than sending it to our national artist rights organisation (a corrupt organisation dividing the money coming in from blank CD-s etc. among themselves... on every blank DVD I buy here I pay an additional cost of around 35%... by the law... and all this money goes into this organisation and disapperas without any accountability about who got it and why... it's just insane.)
Message 11/13 08-Feb-08 @ 05:22 PM Edit: 08-Feb-08 | 05:22 PM - RE: thiefs...
the post it to yourself is nothing more than supporting evidence should it come to a dispute in court.
in the uk your work is copyrighted as soon as you record it, whether you're being ripped off by/member of a rights collection scam/organisation or not.
personally, i wouldn't worry about it.
in the uk your work is copyrighted as soon as you record it, whether you're being ripped off by/member of a rights collection scam/organisation or not.
personally, i wouldn't worry about it.
Message 12/13 08-Feb-08 @ 06:17 PM - RE: thiefs...
True about copyright on creation, but it's the proving of who created first that can be the problem.
Ripped off? Scam?
I joined PRS & MCPS twelve years ago and have received more from them than the 50 squid paid to join.
Even some plays on local radio produces a cheque. They send a free mag regularly and never hassle me to buy stuff. I think they're champion. Very glad I joined.
Ripped off? Scam?
I joined PRS & MCPS twelve years ago and have received more from them than the 50 squid paid to join.
Even some plays on local radio produces a cheque. They send a free mag regularly and never hassle me to buy stuff. I think they're champion. Very glad I joined.
Message 13/13 08-Feb-08 @ 08:08 PM - RE: thiefs...
good point, and that'd be ascap in usa, you can register your songs with them using a submission form
___________________________________
I had an idea for a script once. It's basically Jaws except when the guys in the boat are going after Jaws, they look around and there's an even bigger Jaws. The guys have to team up with Jaws to get Bigger Jaws.... I call it... Big Jaws!!!
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