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Subject: ESI32 or S2000?


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Original Message 1/38             19-Mar-98  @  08:34 PM   -   ESI32 or S2000?

Becky

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I have a CS1x and am looking to get a sampler,
these 2 seem the best contenders, and are reasonably cheap...
Any thoughts?



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Message 2/38             20-Mar-98  @  03:49 AM   -   RE: ESI32 or S2000?

self_osc

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if you like filters and sound manipulation buy the ESI
Itīs have a lot of DSP power and really beefy filters,
plus you can add the expansion board and get 16
new types, the EIV ones!!!!!!
4 outs is good enough for a start, but the same
exp. board (the CALAMARI) gives you a 4 more and
S/PDIF I/O.
Now the ESI comes standard with SCSI interfase, so
for a little more you can purchase a removable storage
media.
Also, a dual FX processor is now aviable for this machine,
so theres nothing better in the S2000 over the ESI32

Dan



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Message 3/38             20-Mar-98  @  04:59 PM   -   RE: ESI32 or S2000?

Becky

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What about internal resampling though. I know the ESI32 can't do it.

Not sure about the Akai.



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Message 4/38             20-Mar-98  @  08:23 PM   -   RE: ESI32 or S2000?

self_osc

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Nop!, the S2000 canīt do internal resampling.
For this thask you shoud look at the ASR (Ensoniq) family
or the top E-mu range (but this are expensive)
A second hand ASR10 gives you internal resampling thru the
FX!!!!, also you can sequence a pattern, play it
and resample the sound while the seq is running, or sample
an external source with FX. The only real down side of
the ASR10 are the NON RESONANT filters (if you can
live with a max of 16 Mbytes and only 8 instruments in
the internal sequencer)
The very new ASRX drum machine style sampler is the
son of the ASR thechnology, and have pros and cons
over the 10.
Pros: resonant filters, new awesome FX, cool pads, up to
34 Mbytes (standard is 2), 16 instruments sequencer,
ROM sounds and ROM expansion slot for MR compatible
boards (dance board kicks!)
Cons: reduced sample editing compared with the old 10,
reduced sequencer edition, only 1 sample rate (44.1 KHz)
and nothing more
I love this machine because is a great compositional
tool and a versatile live instrument, and I hope I can
purchase one in 1 or 2 months
But, if I have to choose one of the samplers that you
are asking about, Iīll get the E-Mu without any doubt

And please sorry for my crappy english



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Message 5/38             20-Mar-98  @  08:57 PM   -   RE: ESI32 or S2000?

Prophecyīs SubOscillator is a sample wave?

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I think thats the sub-osc of my Prophecy is a sample
wave
I guess it because:
1.Take an initialazed patch, go to the mixer section and
turn off Osc1, then let the Sub go to out 1 at max volume.
Go to the Filter section and select the "paralell"
configuration and turn filter 1 tu "THRU" mode. Then
go to the sub and select waveform=SAW, and tracking the
osc1 2 OCTAVES ABOVE
in this situation, if you play the kbd at a medium to high
note. What do you hear? under the SAW wave you can
notice a very loud alias wave..........mmmmmmmm
2.You donīt have PWM in this oscillator (impossible if it a
sample single cycle wave)

Try this and say me if I am wrong, please!

DAN



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Message 6/38             20-Mar-98  @  09:33 PM   -   RE: ESI32 or S2000?

Becky

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Thanks for the good info... I'll probably get a ESI32 once I can afford it.
I was keen on the Akai because it seems to be widely used in jungle, which
is what I'm into.
The ASR-x and ASR10 are way more expensive right?



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Message 7/38             23-Mar-98  @  11:50 AM   -   RE: ESI32 or S2000?

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yeah, but those machines are H-O-T! worth any penny!



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Message 8/38             23-Mar-98  @  02:08 PM   -   RE: ESI32 or S2000?

Houseman

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The ASR-X lists for $1600 US. Add SCSI for about $200, add the Urban Dance card for about $375-$400 (worth every penny), and add the Output X-Pander (8 extra outs) for about $200.



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Message 9/38             29-Mar-98  @  08:04 PM   -   RE: ESI32 or S2000?

Becky

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I just checked out a music store... and it seems like the ESI32 is going out
of production. They had one left in the back (none on display) for $699 + tax;
which seems like a pretty good deal, but I don't have the cash right now...

The store also had a somewhat crummy looking S2000 (also $699), but it also looked
like one of the last ones. They were pushing hard the ESI4000, A3000, and
ASR-X, and the like... in the more expensive price range.

Are the manufacturers giving up on those midrange machines? It seems like you
have to either buy a crappy 'MC' type 'DJ device' like a Yamaha SU10, or a
Roland DR Sampler; or get an all in 1 super production machine...

Kilo, or anyone, any insights to what's happening in the market?



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Message 10/38             30-Mar-98  @  12:06 AM   -   RE: ESI32 or S2000?

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If you are just getting to sampling buy the esi 32!!!!
the manual is excellent and you'll be familiar with the dope operating system right away.The calamari board that was talked about earlier turns this mid range sampler into a contender!!!The board gives you 2 seperate effects
(with their own output)E4 filter set(stoked!)spdif digital outs'and 2 more analog sub outs.So i say grab an esi32 before they are gone,or buy one used,but definitly get the turbo expansion board also called calamari!!

Peace
Jason



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Message 11/38             30-Mar-98  @  06:12 AM   -   RE: ESI32 or S2000?

kid303

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Yeah,i've had an esi32 for over a year now and it's a real joy to use.Excellent build quality. Mine has 32meg of ram and the 3.02 version s/ware.Buy one.



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Message 12/38             30-Mar-98  @  06:20 AM   -   RE: ESI32 or S2000?

Hilevelt

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esi-32's for $699 is pretty common, I've heard of $599 even. Emu's always have a great os and service is easy, at least in the US.



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Message 13/38             30-Mar-98  @  10:33 AM   -   RE: ESI32 or S2000?

kilo

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agreed emu os is very easy usually....anfd they have wonderful converters.... but there were some horrific early s/w versions weren't there ?....... I do like thast asr-x tho....... I'd have to say go for that...... becuase well, i dunno....... it's got so much good stuff for dance toons..... and the resampling for me is the killer....... not that keen on the aksi tho....... i dunno...... they are all ok i reckon...... but you have to expand em all......to reall get tyem kicking..... the new asr-x comes with scsi, full synth, fx and resampling as standard.....2 out's is less of a problem when you get full synth and fx built in......with resampling, fx can easily be added to individual sounds...... I think the asr-x offers a more ready to go solution..... it's all in there already.....AND it reads .WAV and Midifiles..... THIS SHOULD NOT BE OVERLOOKED... wheras the others need an update...and will not read .wav..... or run sequences..... ram doesnt count, cos 32mb is so rediculously cheap now.... 25 quid in the uk....... less than a secnd hand pedal.... just remeber with the asr-x.....you get a live tool too...... plus a synth.....



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Message 14/38             03-Apr-98  @  12:20 AM   -   RE: ESI32 or S2000?

jet

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what about yamaha a300? it's in the same price range as far as i know



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Message 15/38             03-Apr-98  @  02:34 AM   -   RE: ESI32 or S2000?

Becky

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A3000 is about $1200 to my knowledge. I've seen ESI32 for $699, someone said $599, almost half price! S2000 also $699.
By the way, reading SOS, prices seem much inflated in the UK... $1.6~1 pound, but the prices conversion seems to be $1=1 pound.



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Message 16/38             03-Apr-98  @  03:20 AM   -   RE: ESI32 or S2000?

Hilevelt

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emu's American, so that explains that, and Yamaha properly compensates for the exchange rate. The biggest difference is that stores in the uk sell for close to retail, while American retailers will sell for at least 30% less than retail (I purchased my e6400 new, when I had it, for 50% of retail).

Also, just like I've said so many times, you can upgrade the esi-32 to an esi-4000 by simply getting ahold of a copy of the os, which emu recently proved by offering it for sale for $99. But go to your local shop and do it yourself for free like I did.



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Message 17/38             03-Apr-98  @  03:01 PM   -   RE: ESI32 or S2000?

kilo

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hold up tho....... the ASR-x now comes with scsi and the dance expansion board AS STANDARD !!..... and it's around for less than a K....... c'mon.... it's gotta be a better option than the esi fer fucks sake....... plus it'll read .wav files...&. midi-files...ALL YOU NEED is a cheap scsi card..... and you get a docking workstation.... with ability to read akai S-1000/1100 cdroms from your pc drive...archive, edit and manage .WAV samples & midifiles to & from the ASR-X........ and you geta 24 mb synth section. with res' filters, Lfo's envelopes etc etc...... 2 multi-fx processors........ FULL resampling of EVERY setting.....EVEN OF INCOMING AUDIO.... including any midi loops that are playing from the sequencer, complete with ALL controller moves, AND FX realtime moves as well........ I CANNOT see it being beaten... plus..... it can plug into your pc for day to day use... and then un-dock for live gigs..... are you mad to still think of any of the other 2 ??...., where SCSI is option... synthesis & filters is option..... NO resampling... NO synth.. NO playable pads... NO sequencer........ NO FX.... etc etc..... you people must be nutz to ignore it.......read the ASR-X page again.... then remeber the price is LESS than a K now in the Uk..... and the scsi & dance-board are INCLUDED !!!!!!!!!...........



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Message 18/38             03-Apr-98  @  07:00 PM   -   RE: ESI32 or S2000?

Becky

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Yeah, but is it worth twice the price? Over here the ASR-x is about $1200...
Now having said that, I'm using a PC sequencer, and I don't want to shell out for
a built in sequencer which I won't be using.
And even if this thing is great, those rubber pads are crap... who came up with those?
am I supposed to hit them with drum sticks? Ok so you can ignore them...
I don't know... even if it looks great on paper there's definitely something 'square' about
this thing... like the MC303 it seems to promise 'instant' tunes, and I just can't buy anything
that's marketed with the slogan "the ultimate groove machine"...



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Message 19/38             03-Apr-98  @  08:11 PM   -   RE: ESI32 or S2000?

DIGS

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Right on becky,sometimes you have to read between the lines!!I have a groovebox and it just didn't deliver everything the documentation said it would.It didn't live up to the specs!This ASR-x does seem to be quite a bit more usefull than the groovebox,but it costs quite a bit more!The standard outputs are,for me,a wonderful thing.I like to be able to process each sound individually.If you can control the ASR-x like you can a normal sampling unit then that is cool as long as the price comes down a bit!! As for the sequencer that little unit will allow you to be portable.Maybe you're on holiday(english lingo how bout that:-) and you get a bit inspired and you want to lay down some beats well you have a handy little sequencer and controller in one! Really this is what I was looking for in the groovebox,and if I can sell the thing(nobody wants it for 450.00 US)then I am going to consider the ASR-x,but most of all consider your needs!!

PEACE DIGS



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Message 20/38             03-Apr-98  @  08:12 PM   -   RE: ESI32 or S2000?

DIGS

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Right on becky,sometimes you have to read between the lines!!I have a groovebox and it just didn't deliver everything the documentation said it would.It didn't live up to the specs!This ASR-x does seem to be quite a bit more usefull than the groovebox,but it costs quite a bit more!The standard outputs are,for me,a wonderful thing.I like to be able to process each sound individually.If you can control the ASR-x like you can a normal sampling unit then that is cool as long as the price comes down a bit!! As for the sequencer that little unit will allow you to be portable.Maybe you're on holiday(english lingo how bout that:-) and you get a bit inspired and you want to lay down some beats well you have a handy little sequencer and controller in one! Really this is what I was looking for in the groovebox,and if I can sell the thing(nobody wants it for 450.00 US)then I am going to consider the ASR-x,but most of all consider your needs!!

PEACE DIGS



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Message 21/38             03-Apr-98  @  08:16 PM   -   RE: ESI32 or S2000?

DIGS

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Right on becky,sometimes you have to read between the lines!!I have a groovebox and it just didn't deliver everything the documentation said it would.It didn't live up to the specs!This ASR-x does seem to be quite a bit more usefull than the groovebox,but it costs quite a bit more!The standard outputs are,for me,a wonderful thing.I like to be able to process each sound individually.If you can control the ASR-x like you can a normal sampling unit then that is cool as long as the price comes down a bit!! As for the sequencer that little unit will allow you to be portable.Maybe you're on holiday(english lingo how bout that:-) and you get a bit inspired and you want to lay down some beats well you have a handy little sequencer and controller in one! Really this is what I was looking for in the groovebox,and if I can sell the thing(nobody wants it for 450.00 US)then I am going to consider the ASR-x,but most of all consider your needs!!

PEACE DIGS



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Message 22/38             03-Apr-98  @  08:17 PM   -   RE: ESI32 or S2000?

DIGS

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Right on becky,sometimes you have to read between the lines!!I have a groovebox and it just didn't deliver everything the documentation said it would.It didn't live up to the specs!This ASR-x does seem to be quite a bit more usefull than the groovebox,but it costs quite a bit more!The standard outputs are,for me,a wonderful thing.I like to be able to process each sound individually.If you can control the ASR-x like you can a normal sampling unit then that is cool as long as the price comes down a bit!! As for the sequencer that little unit will allow you to be portable.Maybe you're on holiday(english lingo how bout that:-) and you get a bit inspired and you want to lay down some beats well you have a handy little sequencer and controller in one! Really this is what I was looking for in the groovebox,and if I can sell the thing(nobody wants it for 450.00 US)then I am going to consider the ASR-x,but most of all consider your needs!!

PEACE DIGS



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Message 23/38             03-Apr-98  @  08:22 PM   -   RE: ESI32 or S2000?

DIGS

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Right on becky,sometimes you have to read between the lines!!I have a groovebox and it just didn't deliver everything the documentation said it would.It didn't live up to the specs!This ASR-x does seem to be quite a bit more usefull than the groovebox,but it costs quite a bit more!The standard outputs are,for me,a wonderful thing.I like to be able to process each sound individually.If you can control the ASR-x like you can a normal sampling unit then that is cool as long as the price comes down a bit!! As for the sequencer that little unit will allow you to be portable.Maybe you're on holiday(english lingo how bout that:-) and you get a bit inspired and you want to lay down some beats well you have a handy little sequencer and controller in one! Really this is what I was looking for in the groovebox,and if I can sell the thing(nobody wants it for 450.00 US)then I am going to consider the ASR-x,but most of all consider your needs!!

PEACE DIGS



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Message 24/38             03-Apr-98  @  08:32 PM   -   RE: ESI32 or S2000?

kilo

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yeah i agree..... I am also always willing to overlook the actual spec's of an intended purchase if i like the style of the advertising .......and it's true about the pads.... the rubber pads on the Akai-Roger Linn and the MPC series are crap too........!!! (???)...... strange.... still i guess once you pay the tax... and pay for the filter/synth board... and the extra for the scsi..... it'll be worth it....... you did ask my opinion....... and I say..... save up a bit more and look DEEPly into the possiblities of a unit with all that & more included .......and it's totally interfacable with the pc.......straight from the box !!...... and reads akai....... also..... check the s/w version of the cheap ESI you saw....... most importantly..... none of the listed contender have re-sampling..... or fx...... maybe the retail price is high in wherever you are,....... but in the uK retail of the ASR is under a K ........ yup..... it's 200 quid more than an akia or esi..... but check the price for the expansions to get up to spec on the others.... it'll cost you alot more in the end........ also...... can the esi or the s-2000 save long samples to consecutive disk??........ i actually dont know that one..... but it;s very important...... anyone know ??



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Message 25/38             05-Apr-98  @  10:33 AM   -   RE: ESI32 or S2000?

bob

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uh the pads suck ? how about aftertouch you assholes ? How about note repeat. I mean, buying a groovebox in the first place.....haha hehe haha......



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Message 26/38             06-Apr-98  @  10:48 AM   -   RE: ESI32 or S2000?

kilo

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ai ia ia !!... i thought i'd get a slagging for that...... well I just think that as most dance is about simple patterns....as RHYTHMS..... as opposed to playing like a keyboard player style where notes, scales etc are the priority........ they are valuable...... also obviously for drums.....



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Message 27/38             06-Apr-98  @  08:56 PM   -   RE: ESI32 or S2000?

Becky

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Hey Hilevelt, mind expanding on getting that OS upgrade for free?

I've never understood OS upgrades for synths are they software or hardware
(like a chip inside)? ...Oooer... does that mean you stole the chip from inside
the shop copy?

The CS1x has recently upgraded from OS 1.05 to 1.08, anyone know how to
get a copy? Yamaha don't saay anything on their web site...



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Message 28/38             07-Apr-98  @  12:41 AM   -   RE: ESI32 or S2000?

bob

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Kilo wrote "well I just think that as most dance is about simple patterns"

There you go folks.....



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Message 29/38             07-Apr-98  @  04:14 AM   -   RE: ESI32 or S2000?

Hilevelt

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The emu os is s/w...just go figure it out, or use your womanly charms to get the salesman to pull out the manual pack, which comes with a copy. hehehe, Kilo getting slagged "you're a wind bag and never programmed a note in your life, while Bob's a real musician who can hear that Josh Wink Major 3rd two minutes into the track...."

in a sing-songy tone "DJ Shadow made a record with an MPC-60, he's got more money than any of us. Kurt Cobain couldn't play a C Major scale, now he-ee's de-ead."



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Message 30/38             07-Apr-98  @  06:10 AM   -   RE: ESI32 or S2000?

kid303

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Well to upgrade my esi to version 3 i had to remove 2 chips and replace them with 2 new ones so i doubt if you
can download the new os onto a floppy.



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Message 31/38             07-Apr-98  @  07:54 PM   -   RE: ESI32 or S2000?

Hilevelt

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kid, emu only does s/w upgrades now, unless it's an expansion board.



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Message 32/38             07-Apr-98  @  09:40 PM   -   RE: ESI32 or S2000?

Becky

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Hey, it's official. Just heard from Emu... The ESI32 is out of production, being replaced
by the ESI4000...
Those mid range machines don't make them any money I guess... shame cos I think they're enough for most people.



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Message 33/38             10-Apr-98  @  12:12 AM   -   RE: ESI32 or S2000?

DIGS

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Hilevelt,does the software upgrade accomplish the same thing as the rom chips I got with my torbo option(calamari)upgrade?It seems odd that they would have ever offered rom upgrades if the same thing could have been done with software.Uhh???????Right??
DIGS



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Message 34/38             10-Apr-98  @  01:49 AM   -   RE: ESI32 or S2000?

Hilevelt

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your calamari board is worth it, extra outputs are golden, but the filters are s/w



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Message 35/38             15-Apr-98  @  05:58 PM   -   RE: ESI32 or S2000?

Purple Haze

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Hmmm... some thoughts when reading all of the above...

I've owned an esi-32 for about 8 months now, the upgrade to eos3.1 (or is that 3.0 ? forgot) is for free if you bought the machine after april '97 or something. For as far as I know the upgrade (which is a software upgrade) can only be done by replacing the rom's which contain the software with the new ones. If anyone out there was able to upgrade his esi32 by just inserting a disk with a new os or something (like I think is possible on the akai's) then let me know, I'd be very interested to know how he did it (the esi is using a processor based on the motorola 68000, and I just happen to know this processor like the back of my hand, so if I'd be able to access and change the software the esi is running, I might be able to add some minor sysex support and stuff).

Overall I'm pretty pleased with my esi, the only disadvantage being that I seem to be unable to find that 30 (or is that 32? smoked too much last night I guess) pins 16mb ram (4mb is highest I found so far).

As to the only difference between the esi32 and esi4000 being the software... well, the esi4000 have 64 voice polyphony, and uses the 'more normal' 72 pins simms which are generally much cheaper and easier to find.

Hmm... a friend of mine has an S2000 which I played around with a bit, wouldn't trade it for the esi32.

The Purple one.



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Message 36/38             15-Apr-98  @  06:27 PM   -   RE: ESI32 or S2000?

kid303

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Well thats what i tried to tell the man! The esi4000 also goes upto 128 meg ram but I'm finding
my 32 note and 32 megs not too limiting.



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Message 37/38             17-Apr-98  @  04:05 PM   -   RE: ESI32 or S2000?

DIGS

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My man Adam Cowen at sweetwater sound can hook you up with Ram.They'll also take your old simms in trade!!
Peace DIGS



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Message 38/38             21-Apr-98  @  12:35 PM   -   RE: ESI32 or S2000?

Hilevelt

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uh, fellas, even EMAX's are s/w upgradable (yes, slip in a disk and you're done). While swapping chips might give you some benefits I don't know about, a lot of the relevant factors can be upgraded like this.

BTW, if anybody owns an e64, I'd be happy to upload the newest OS and the Sound Diver s/w.



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