 |
 |
 |
 |
 |
 |
 |
Forums - Synths & synthesis
Subject: bass
Original Message Date: 01-Oct-02 @ 09:11 PM - bass
Not sure if this is the most appropriate place to post this message on this site, but it was the best I could find.
I have a question about bass lines.
I have been writing experimental electronic music for about 7 years and am mystified still by some of the bass I hear from techno and rap music. I was wondering if anyone could help clear up what is going on.
What I am talking about is easist to describe in rap music.. the bass line that comes in and goes:
Booooooooooooooom ...... ..... Boooooooooom Boooooooom
Totally fills your speakers, and sounds really warm and smoothe.
Where are they getting that sound... ? How is that being done?
I have:
RM1X
MPC2000XL
ASR-10
ELECTRIBE-R
I have tried everything I can think of myself to replicate this bass line sound.. but am unable to do so... every thing pales in comparison.
Am I making any sense? Any one able to offer any info, advice, or opinions?
I have a question about bass lines.
I have been writing experimental electronic music for about 7 years and am mystified still by some of the bass I hear from techno and rap music. I was wondering if anyone could help clear up what is going on.
What I am talking about is easist to describe in rap music.. the bass line that comes in and goes:
Booooooooooooooom ...... ..... Boooooooooom Boooooooom
Totally fills your speakers, and sounds really warm and smoothe.
Where are they getting that sound... ? How is that being done?
I have:
RM1X
MPC2000XL
ASR-10
ELECTRIBE-R
I have tried everything I can think of myself to replicate this bass line sound.. but am unable to do so... every thing pales in comparison.
Am I making any sense? Any one able to offer any info, advice, or opinions?
Message 32/38 25-Oct-02 @ 09:05 AM - RE: bass
One thing you folks are so sadly not mentioning to is the high-pass trick. So one of the things that makes that sick stuff work is that the bass remains in the USEABLE frequencies of most speakers. I am what most call a bass technician, and especially for recordings (also for live sets, depending on the system's capabilities on which I performing) you HAVE to make sure that you're not just wasting headroom and efficiency in your sound by pumping subsonics that are nothing but energy eaters for most speakers.
I'm playing on some 21-inch woofered Beyma cabinets Saturday night, so I'll tell you about the realities of that after, however even 18's in most configurations can only accurately reproduce freqs so low, and after that, it's just loose speaker wobble, and everything else flubs out.
One of the reasons why the Mini sounds so damn fat is that it's output only goes down to a certain frequency, and then it just does't bother wasting energy. I actually contaced Big Briar about modifying the filter to actually put out those serious subs, and they told me to get a different synth. Efficiency.
Another perfect example....The MS-20. Why doe that thing sound so sick? because it has a hi-pass after the lowpass, and it strips out the unuseable sound and just leaves you with a thick dirty stinky sound that puts the available ow end to use, and doesn't waste it on ULFs.
I've also learned to stand back from my monitors when actually checkin the bass in a mix, listening for ghosts nad dead spots in the sound, cuz the waves just don't come alive that close to nearfields. Physics. Anyhoos, yeah so try using a high pass, like a 12-db around 20-30 hz, and watch what happens to your mix, how it compresses, etc..
Good luck.
Good bass.
Ape
I'm playing on some 21-inch woofered Beyma cabinets Saturday night, so I'll tell you about the realities of that after, however even 18's in most configurations can only accurately reproduce freqs so low, and after that, it's just loose speaker wobble, and everything else flubs out.
One of the reasons why the Mini sounds so damn fat is that it's output only goes down to a certain frequency, and then it just does't bother wasting energy. I actually contaced Big Briar about modifying the filter to actually put out those serious subs, and they told me to get a different synth. Efficiency.
Another perfect example....The MS-20. Why doe that thing sound so sick? because it has a hi-pass after the lowpass, and it strips out the unuseable sound and just leaves you with a thick dirty stinky sound that puts the available ow end to use, and doesn't waste it on ULFs.
I've also learned to stand back from my monitors when actually checkin the bass in a mix, listening for ghosts nad dead spots in the sound, cuz the waves just don't come alive that close to nearfields. Physics. Anyhoos, yeah so try using a high pass, like a 12-db around 20-30 hz, and watch what happens to your mix, how it compresses, etc..
Good luck.
Good bass.
Ape
Message 33/38 25-Oct-02 @ 09:26 AM - RE: bass
^^that guy really knows his bass, let me assure you. listen to him.
and yeah, i´ve noticed that hipass@ 20-30hz never damaged my low end, since it usuall resides in 50-80hz area. true.
and yeah, i´ve noticed that hipass@ 20-30hz never damaged my low end, since it usuall resides in 50-80hz area. true.
Message 34/38 25-Oct-02 @ 12:53 PM - RE: bass
notch filters, bandpass too. and also removing the top end with a lowpass on the kik is another one, alot of people use the top-end on a kik way beyond anything useful which once in the mix just muddy's up the midrange & lower top-end. You can knock your kick down to pass below 300hz or something depending on style (unless you need a real clicky kick.)
Message 35/38 06-Nov-02 @ 07:50 AM - RE: bass
goa kicks are clicky... but i think a kick with out high freq. lacks presence. Yet I am of the school that drums should bang as hard as the can. Every kick, a kick in the nuts and every snare a slap in the face. I hear too many tracks, including tracks from the masters like hallucinogen and AP, were the drums lack presence and the synths do all the work. I thought that Joe Meek taught us that the old saying, rythym parts should be felt and not heard was untrue.
Message 36/38 06-Nov-02 @ 10:19 AM - RE: bass
So if I got this right then.......... The bass should live at a lower frequency than the kick, so...... on the kick, if I use a high pass filter at 40 hertz and a low pass at 2k and then and on the bass, if I use a high pass at 20 hertz and a low pass at say 1k then that would get rid of any unecessary usage of headroom? Is that what you all mean?
Message 37/38 06-Nov-02 @ 05:00 PM - RE: bass
the bass should live at a lower frequency than
the kick if that's what you choose. it could live
at a higher frequency if that's what you choose.
as far as that high-pass/low pass shit goes,
the low E on a bass guitar (for reference here)
has a fundamental tone of 41.2 Hz, if you drop
that to a D it's 36.71. what you hear as the note
has a lot to do with the harmonics and
overtones, but if you run a filter up over the freq
of the lowest note, it'll start sounding thin. but
you can safely run you HPF up to 35-40 Hz
with no ill effect at all and getcha some
headroom.
the kick if that's what you choose. it could live
at a higher frequency if that's what you choose.
as far as that high-pass/low pass shit goes,
the low E on a bass guitar (for reference here)
has a fundamental tone of 41.2 Hz, if you drop
that to a D it's 36.71. what you hear as the note
has a lot to do with the harmonics and
overtones, but if you run a filter up over the freq
of the lowest note, it'll start sounding thin. but
you can safely run you HPF up to 35-40 Hz
with no ill effect at all and getcha some
headroom.
Message 38/38 07-Nov-02 @ 01:04 PM - RE: bass
I'd go lower than that tho (1k) - i'd drop the bass very steeply at 30hz or so (20-40hz)
Look and experiment with narrow frequencies around 80hz and 110 hz for the bass where alot of the 'tone' of the bass lives... personaly unless a clicky kik is required i'd shelve off the kik top end at more like 200hz or so... But I like my kiks more thumpy, I dont like clicky tops on my kiks much... anyways to HEAR what frequencies are going on, add a bandpass filter inserted into your kik or bass and Q it tight and sweep it around the frequencies and listen to what they are and what they are doing. This can give you more of an idea what's happening in various frequency bands & get you more familiar with the characteristic's of various freq' bands.
Look and experiment with narrow frequencies around 80hz and 110 hz for the bass where alot of the 'tone' of the bass lives... personaly unless a clicky kik is required i'd shelve off the kik top end at more like 200hz or so... But I like my kiks more thumpy, I dont like clicky tops on my kiks much... anyways to HEAR what frequencies are going on, add a bandpass filter inserted into your kik or bass and Q it tight and sweep it around the frequencies and listen to what they are and what they are doing. This can give you more of an idea what's happening in various frequency bands & get you more familiar with the characteristic's of various freq' bands.
Pages: 1 2 3 4
There are 38 total messages for this topic
Reply to Thread
You need to register/login to use the forum.
Click here to Signup or Login !
[you'll be brought right back to this point after signing up]
Back to Forum
